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> PPK equals browser discrimination with sexism and racism
Christian J
post Oct 12 2017, 10:33 AM
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http://www.quirksmode.org/blog/archives/20...lephant_in.html

Not sure if he's entirely serious, but he does raise an interesting point:

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The next billion, most of whom are on cheap Android devices without the latest and greatest browsing software, are mostly poor — and mostly black or brown anyway — so they don’t fit in our business model.

Basically, smartphone users are stuck with the OS and supporting browsers that came with the phone, and poor people can't afford new phones every other year. There are also wealthy people that lack the enthusiasm for replacing their old phones until they break. If anyone wants to reach these groups for education, advertizing or political campaigns, it might be important to consider the mobile browsers they'll likely be using for years.
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pandy
post Oct 12 2017, 10:45 AM
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There are also middle class desktop users that don't like the limited choice of more or less dumbed down browers that are recent enough to be "supported" by the sites that play that game. ninja.gif

Just today k-mel got locked out from a forum I frequent. Well, not locked out, but there are no editor to type in, none at all. I smell browser sniffing.
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Christian J
post Oct 12 2017, 10:57 AM
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That's different, because on desktop we have a choice* to install something that "works". But there are plenty of people that can only access the web from a smartphone (unless they go to an Internet café, perhaps).

* That this choice usually contains telemetry/spyware these days is another issue.
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pandy
post Oct 12 2017, 12:26 PM
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What stops them from installing another browser? Unless their OS is outdated and not supported by the browser of course.
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Christian J
post Oct 12 2017, 12:45 PM
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That's what I meant, the OS does become outdated quickly and then you can't update the browsers either.

Perhaps people could install Cyanogenmod or something similar instead, maybe phone service shops in poor countries could help with that.
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pandy
post Oct 13 2017, 06:46 AM
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Right. That figures. I'm so not interested in mobile that I don't know hardly anything about it. I use my phone for other things, but browsing the web I don't unless I'm in a pickle. I don't even know how to install a ROM or even what it is. cool.gif
Seems the days of CyanogenMod are over anyway.
https://www.androidauthority.com/cyanogenmo...neageos-654810/

I hope everyone realizes that this happens in the wake of the browser upgrade campaign. It became legit to not serve everyone, it even became fancy. The most stupid thing is that most sites work fine in a few years old browsers, but most often they don't even let them in to avoid having to "support" them. The web has become like fashion. Get the latest or you're out. And get mainstream! I couldn't even install a "bank ID" on XP and I know it's pretty hopeless on Linux. So should everyone get on the Win10 train or keep their money in a box under their bed?

BTW, wasn't ppk against the Browser Upgrade Campaign? Or he thought it was too early, something like that.
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pandy
post Oct 13 2017, 07:00 AM
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I just had to. biggrin.gif

IPB Image IPB Image IPB Image IPB Image IPB Image IPB Image IPB Image

IPB Image
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Christian J
post Oct 13 2017, 10:44 AM
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QUOTE(pandy @ Oct 13 2017, 01:46 PM) *

I hope everyone realizes that this happens in the wake of the browser upgrade campaign. It became legit to not serve everyone, it even became fancy.

Can't remember. Browser sniffing of course existed even before that, but maybe that campaign offered a moral justification. Also there's a difference between using the "wrong" brand and an old version of the right brand. Chrome and Firefox check for updates by default AFAIK, so old versions shouldn't be a common issue. In addition, I suspect the public is so dependent on GMail, Youtube and Facebook that they'll update right away from fear of being locked out.

QUOTE
The most stupid thing is that most sites work fine in a few years old browsers, but most often they don't even let them in to avoid having to "support" them.

I can understand it when it's an important functionality, like online shopping or banking, where a bug may not be noticed by the user. I can also understand that a designer don't want complaints from a client because the site looks bad in some obscure browser, especially if the budget has already been blown on placing the social media icons just right. But as often as not it's probably just laziness.

QUOTE
BTW, wasn't ppk against the Browser Upgrade Campaign? Or he thought it was too early, something like that.

No idea, I had forgotten all about it.

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